Alsuren

May 13, 2010

The Monogamy Assumption

Filed under: facebook — Tags: , , , , , , , , , , — alsuren @ 12:00 am

As an Engineer, I believe that simplifying assumptions are morally essential for a well lived life. When I consider Kant’s Categorical Imperative[1], I think of it as a simplifying assumption, which makes your life better, rather than something which produces moral value from nothingness.

[1] http://alsuren.wordpress.com/2009/04/04/notes-on-kant/

One key assumption that I’ve been re-evaluating recently is the one that says “You can only be romantically faithful to one person at a time.” The question that interests me is: “does this assumption actually make my (or my partner’s) life any better?”

I’m going to focus on the problem of finding a potential life partner, because this is one of the main things I look for. The aim here is finding someone who is good for you, and working around kinds of problems that might break you up. What I’m going to do is take a few problems that I have encountered in the past, and see how they might work out under different sets of assumptions.

One of the problems that I have come across is the fear that you will fall in love with someone and prematurely commit your life to them exclusively. If you do this, then you will spend the rest of your life wondering what life could have been like with someone else. This surfaces as a problem when someone thinks “My life would be better with this other person that I’ve just met.” and jumps ship without consulting their current partner. This is a common grounds for divorce, so it’s obviously a big problem for monogamous relationships.

If you and your partner both question the monogamy assumption, then you have a lot more options open here. Being in love with someone other than the person you first thought of is not something that needs to be a problem. If you have discussed the possibility, and are both comfortable before you start pursuing it, then it doesn’t have to weaken your existing relationship. In fact, hearing about and meeting the other wonderful people in your partner’s life can be an extra special source of joy. It certainly has been for me.

It should probably be noted at this point that I have only ever broken off a relationship with one person (Marci) due to a fear of not knowing anyone else. I don’t think we had an explicit understanding that we would get back together afterwards, but we did have an understanding that it wasn’t a lack of love that was causing me to want to seek other partners, and it allowed us to remain friends while we dated other people (she even helped to set me up with my second girlfriend) and pick things up from an even stronger base afterwards. I think that the signature of good communication and re-negotiation in that relationship is something that it shares with most shining examples of poly-amorous relationships from the literature, even though we each considered ourselves to be monogamous, and were in our own monogamous relationships during the year that we weren’t seeingeach other.

So far, we’ve covered the ‘other people’ problem. What else is there? This next one might be quite specific to me, but it’s still worth addressing. Sometimes, I find myself in the situation where I have not been able to devote the time/attention to my partner that they deserve. In most cases, it’s because of a change in our every-day commitments, but It’s especially bad when I find myself in a different timezone from my partner. The fact that I find myself in this situation might also have something to do with the fact that I enjoy having very involved conversations with people over IM, and I often end up forming relationships off the back of that. IM is significantly more time consuming than phone or face-to-face communication, so in the long run, it is easy to spend hours chatting and at the end not feel like you’ve given as much of yourself as you wanted to. If you feel like your partner is passing up on other opportunities in their life in order to talk to you, and you don’t feel like you are able to give them enough of yourself to really deserve that, then there is a case for improving your time management, or expectation management skills. The danger here is if you let this make you feel guilty, and associating that guilt with your partner without really asking why, or addressing it with them until it becomes a problem. I could probably improve my skill at pro-actively discussing my emotions with my partner, and where they come from, so I have (on more than one occasion) let negative feelings undermine my relationship with someone, and then springing it on them when it’s already too late to address the problem constructively.

In terms of the energy and devotion in a polyamorous relationship, I don’t think that I can really comment with any authority. This is because my current relationship is still very new, and there tends to be a skew towards obsessing about your partner whenever you have a new relationship (This is referred to as “New relationship energy” in the literature). This means that any data I have about how much attention to expect might be skewed. On the other hand, it is worth questioning the notion that love is a quantifiable thing: “If you have 100 pounds of love, you can give 100 pounds to your partner, but if you have multiple partners, you have to split the 100 pounds between them” [2]. There are a lot of people who will tell you that this really isn’t how it works. Certainly, I would object if an only child asserted that they got twice as much love as me or my sister.

[2] Ideas and quotes taken from Opening up (A Guide to Creating and Sustaining Open relationships) — Tristan Taormino.

So I don’t think that I have enough experience to conclude anything about how much attention to expect from a partner in a stable polyamorous relationship. I also don’t have *any* first hand experience of how the time-management might work if I found *myself* in more than one relationship. At the moment, I am spending a lot of time reading around the subject of polyamoury, as well as writing blog posts like this one. This is a devotion that hopefully won’t be so time-consuming once I feel comfortable enough to start a new relationship with someone else. I guess I’ll have to try it and report back. Watch this space.

There are a few time management things worth mentioning that are probably orthogonal to monogamy. One is that we use each other for time-boxing (in this case, focussing on specific tasks for 2 hour slots, and reporting back for 10 minutes afterwards). This means that we can have the feeling of being useful to each other, without eating each other’s time or feeling like we’re ignoring each other. The other thing is that we often use Skype instead of IM for talking before work and in the evenings. This genuinely helps in that it lets us make better use of a given amount of time, and we are less likely to have remaining issues to distract us when we’re supposed to be working. The fact that we both have phones with Skype built in probably helps too, because we don’t have the sound issues caused by laptop fans, and we have the freedom to wander around the house while we talk.

Now that I’ve covered an emotional need, and a practical need, what about physical needs? A little disclaimer might be appropriate now. To me, if a relationship is based solely upon physical intimacy (to the point where it can’t survive a period of physical separation) then it is probably not strong enough to endure a lifetime. It would be dishonest to pretend that we don’t have physical needs and desires though, so I’ll try to address them here. Without being too graphic, I’m going to sidestep this topic a bit and assert that while it’s nice to be sexual with the person you love, you don’t actually *need* a partner for sexual release. This leaves the need for physical closeness as a separate, non-sexual requirement, that can be satisfied with lots of hugs. Being in relationships with people from other countries and cities over the years has lead me get quite good at hugging (I’m sure that many people in 6th form assumed that I was either gay, or seeing one of the girls in my group of friends). This is a comfortable arrangement for me, but I can tell what you’re all thinking, so let’s talk about that too: “If I have someone in another city to provide for my emotional needs, why not pursue a purely sexual relationship in my own city?” Having someone to hold in my own city would be good, and I’d be happy having a non-serious relationship involving lots of hugging. If a relationship like that slowly turned into something sexual, then I might be comfortable with that, but I would try to err on the side of taking things slower than they need to be, rather than quicker. I think that alarm bells would start ringing if the sexual side of the relationship obliterated the holding each other and talking side. It’s still something that I am thinking about, and I’m not going to say anything too firm about how I feel at this point, because I’d like to avoid having to eat my hat later.

Finally, I’d like to consider our evolutionary needs. To me, the idea of passing something of myself (not only my genes, but also my beliefs and general perception of the world) on to future generations is very important. What this effectively means in the context of a monogamous relationship is: “could I see myself raising kids with this person?”. To some people, this may be a scary question to be asking at any point, because once you commit to “yes”, you can’t change your mind to “no” without ruining someone’s life. I personally tend to use it more as a measure in the back of my mind. I’m in no rush to actually have kids. My priorities have always been to complete a PhD before I do anything drastic like having children, hence I don’t have this pressure to commit to “yes”. Saying that, if the answer ever becomes “no”, then the “potential life partner” criterion is somewhat in trouble.

If you remove the assumption of monogamy then suddenly the statement “I want to spend the rest of my life with this person” is no longer dependent on “I want to raise kids with this person.” To be clear, it would seem very unwise to enter into relationships with multiple partners with the intention of eventually dumping everyone else and having kids with the person that you like the most. Such an intention would give everyone a reason to feel jealous of (and threatened by) everyone else. This doesn’t sound like a recipe for a healthy relationship. To avoid this situation, you would need to make sure that you get into relationships which you’d want to keep for life, even if you will only have children with someone else.

While I wouldn’t like to pretend that you can plan these things, I’d say that at least one potentially ideal situation is the one where you are involved with someone that you would hypothetically want to have kids with, and then meet someone else who you can fall in love with, but isn’t interested in having kids with you (or would be interested in raising children with your other partner in a triad, but that’s more complicated). If you happen to meet someone who wants to have kids with someone else then you’ve probably hit the jackpot. That way, when you suddenly find that you don’t have as much time for their relationship, they might not mind too much because they are looking after their kids too. I suspect that this comes back to the time management thing again, which is not something that I’m going to explore any further at the moment.

As you can see, I am coming to the conclusion that polyamoury could be quite well suited to the problem of finding a life partner. It really flies in the face of how I’m used to doing things, but I have been quite lucky in finding someone who is willing to invest the time and emotional energy to discuss these things with me. I would really like to encourage discussion in the comments or with me in person, so that people have a chance to question and understand the views that I have. There are quite a lot of concerns that I won’t have addressed (and some that I won’t have even thought of because I’m just starting out), so please do ask lots of questions via facebook or wordpress comments, and I might even turn some of my answers into blog posts in their own right.

September 7, 2008

Marci

Filed under: Uncategorized — Tags: , , , , , — alsuren @ 7:11 pm

I decided to watch Dirty Dancing last night, between 9 and bed. I’d never seen it before, but since watching it, I can see why Salsa is more popular than Lindy (compare with ‘Swing Kids’ and you’ll understand).

Towards the end of the film, I realised that the main character looks a lot like Marci’s kid sister. I say kid, but Kristi’s probably older than Marci ever was by now, and is engaged to be married. I think that everyone in that family is [/was] beautiful, in some delightfully elegant/awkward way (I’m waiting for Jared to say something here). I kind of get the feeling that even if Marci were still around, we might still be attending another family wedding before having our own.

So at any rate: I went to bed thinking about Marci, and it occurred to me that I still haven’t done a proper public summary, and resolved to do so today. In the interests of keeping resolutions, I will start at the beginning:

To set the scene, picture me as a 15 year old, or so, with Terrible Acne (worse than Shanahan’s) back in the days of Windows 2000, and MSN Messenger Plus! with the cinescape Harry Potter Message Boards (yes: they were still called boards rather than forums) as my introduction to the internet proper, and a contact list almost entirely composed of american teenage girls.

The initial encounter went something like this: We were in some group chat with Marci and a friend from some other board. I don’t remember who it was, other than that the other girl was someone I knew better than Marci. Neither can I remember what we were talking about. Probably just growing up and being depressed about body fat, or something girly like that. At some point, this other girl leaves the conversation (I think with the intention of coming back later), so we end up with two chat windows open. We keep talking in the main window, and Marci comes out with *walks towards alsuren* or something, and then in the other window “Play along”. What else could I do? After a few messages back and forth (with no objections from me, as I’d been instructed to play along in the other window) one of us ended up sitting in the other’s lap, and eventually kissing each other. Trying to recall details at this point would be prone to error, but I remember vividly the “play along” part, as it was genius. I think it also became an in joke IRL (In Real Life) as well, and I’ve many times since wanted to do it to someone for real but never had the guts. (If anyone tries that on me for real, I *will* play along, if nothing else because women with that sort of guts are hot as hell.)

The next day, we got talking again. The jist was that I had never kissed anyone before (okay, so I was 15 and ugly as sin), and had wanted my first kiss to be special, so we should really make a go of things. It also turned out that Marci had never kissed anyone before either. She was the self-styled VL (Virgin Lips: don’t worry. I’d never heard the term before either). I never quite worked out whether in Utah, this was considered a good or bad thing, though she always seemed a little depressed about the fact. I suppose she was two years older than me, so it was a little different.

At some point in the next two weeks, I expressed my concern that there was the danger of us getting married without me ever knowing what it was like to be with anyone else. This may have been influenced by my dad’s line in “scary Mormons want to suck you in” comments, though it’s hard to say. I’m not sure whether what happened next says more about her or me: she ended up setting me up with a girl in my class (Charlotte. A plain, quiet girl, and a Christian. It later transpired that she was both slightly skitz, but we won’t dwell on that.)

So that first romance with Marci lasted all of about 2 weeks, but I still count her as both my first kiss and my first love. I always found it harder to tell Marci that I loved her than anyone else, but I suspect that this may be because she is the only person I ever *truly* loved. The relationship with Charlotte lasted for about 3 months, until I realised that I didn’t love her (She seemed very dependant on me, and it occurred to me that I would live just as happily without her. It seemed like it was only her reliance on me that kept us together, which wasn’t healthy. Compare and contrast this with Marci’s attitude.)

In the year that followed, I had one other relationship (Annie, who was a terrible kisser, but strong-willed, intelligent and beautiful to me at the time) and had my heart broken. This relationship also pissed off Mandy, who publicly “went out” with my friend Sam on the boards, who is my oldest friend, and who proceeded to be a complete cock to her. Turned out that this third relationship was the last straw, and she would be ignored no longer.

All of this time, I remained close friends with Marci, who was also dating other people as well, both online and off, but maintains that she never kissed anyone in that time either (though someone did strip off to her on webcam at some point apparently, but I was only told about that later (probably only their shirt or something. I never asked). We’ll come back to that later).

On the year anniversary of our first encounter, I was asked whether I knew what day it was. It took me a while (and probably a hint or two) but eventually I realised. I think the excuse that time was “for old time’s sake” or similar, but whatever the cause, it started again, and in almost the same manner as the previous time. It turned out that she was actually dating someone at the time, so there was even a similar kind of doubting “is this right?” conversation the next day. Much of the next few months was spent in a whirlwind of staying up until stupid-o-clock and sending long emails back and forth, to compensate for the 7 hour time difference. We managed to arrange for her to come over here for a week around valentine’s day (I think this was during one of the legendary Bancroftian 2 week spring half term holidays or something, but I would have to look it up to be sure).

She arrived the day before valentines, and my parents urged her to try to stay awake until a sensible bedtime. I think we ended up resting (but not asleep) on the front room couch before the light was gone, talking about something that probably seemed important at the time. Our first kiss was there, and was both awkward and magical. I think there was some talk of holding out for the next day or something, but being un-planned was better. The next day, on the other hand, had the hell planned out of it. I woke her up with roses and chocolate (I’d bought a big cube-shaped box of chocolates, and put a rose petal in the bottom of each tray, and I’d bought a lead-crystal heart, and put it in the centre. It was all very cheesy, but I think the whole “coming over for valentines” was proof that we were into that kind of thing. We then went out to explore London, and came back for curry (my dad had convinced me that americans didn’t like hot food, so we got something hot and something not. Turns out that Utah isn’t very far from Mexico, and my dad was wrong).

We climbed Monument, and St Paul’s, with a disposable camera recording the events. On the Sunday, she took me to church. I was somewhat in awe of the general kindness and good will displayed there, and the slightly chaotic ceremonies caused by the fact that it was a convert’s church (Mormon) made it entertaining and exciting. I ended up crying at one point, and she noticed. I half wanted her to say something about it being a religious experience, so that I could argue against her, but she didn’t.

At some point during the week, we hooked up with Charlotte and went on the London Eye and played on the lions in Trafalgar Square. Marci also made her “runny cheese cake” which was a little more runny than anticipated (I won’t lie. It was a disaster in almost all respects, including cleaning out the last of the tin with a finger, which caused her injury). It was a good laugh though, and at least Charlotte and Marci enjoyed the end product.

That night, after Charlotte left, we ended up watching some cartoon version of robin hood on the projector in the back room(which is now broken, due to a completely unrelated event). During the course of things, we ended up on top of each other. There was no removal of clothes or anything like that but it turned out this was still a bad idea. She left for her room very upset, and it took me a while to understand that temptation and guilt had a lot to do with it. We talked it over then and a bit the next day, and agreed to strive to never let it happen again. It seemed like a black spot that wasn’t impossible to recover from, and we parted in high spirits, looking forward to the future.

We ended up going through a bit of a rough patch after she went home. I think I was missing her physically, and there was also doubt about when we would next see each other, and whether we would be safe. We took another break at that point, with the agreement this time that we would get back together when things were more certain. I spent a little more time with my school friends, so that I would be more comfortable introducing her to them if she came over again… and then we got together again.

We organised a trip from me to Utah in the summer, with the clever trick of bundling a week long university summer camp so that the university would pay for part of the travel. I got the rest by working for my dad.

At this point, there should be a remark about Mel, who I stopped talking to around this time, but seems to have done well by herself in the meantime.

There was a spot of bother shortly beforehand caused by my habit of getting back from school and going straight on the computer in my school stuff in the middle of summer, and Marci mentioning someone stripping for her *innocent eyes*. I *may* have pretended to undo my belt and then cut off the internet connection, which got an angry email in response. We sorted all that out, and I’m glad we did, because it was a fresh reminder of what to avoid when I was there. What *didn’t* help was that Marci’s mum thought that it would be a good idea to read her daughter’s emails shortly afterwards.

I thought I behaved pretty well while I was there. I even went to sit in the front of the car to reduce the risk of either of us doing something we would regret later. Turns out it saved my life, but this is where her story ends.

So what’s the point of this? Well it’s partly for anyone who finds my terms a little strange, and it’s partly to act a tribute. It’s also a kind of thank-you to everyone who I have met because of her. I think I will go and visit her family when I’ve got some money (probably after my PhD and the associated recovery. Give it five or ten years). I’ll see if I can visit where she did her dancing as well (she was the first person who ever tried (and failed) to teach me to dance, and part of the reason that I decided to go in search of swing when I realised that ballroom was rubbish.)

April 20, 2008

These are my terms

Filed under: Uncategorized — Tags: , — alsuren @ 2:34 pm

These terms do not just apply to romantic love: they also apply to my friends, and to my academic interests:
Do not expect my love without reason. I will love you for the reasons that you present to me in the form of your strengths.
Do not let me believe that I can be loved without reason: If I cannot strive to earn your love, I cannot love you.
Do not believe that I am bound to you love you just because I have loved you in the past.
Do not expect me to tell you that I love you if I don’t. If I am unsure, I will tell you that I don’t .

If you wish to meet me on these terms, I will meet you on these terms. If you wish to be met on any other terms, state them and they will be considered. I will attempt to keep a revised list of my terms up on my wiki.

April 2, 2008

Past few weeks

Filed under: Uncategorized — Tags: , , , , , — alsuren @ 9:20 pm

It seems that I fail horribly. I decided that I would go home over Easter, so that I would be able to go from London to my IBM interview. As a result, I didn’t do any work from Good Friday through to now (I have yet to really start: the last two days have been spent doing only a very few hours each)

I was lent The Fountainhead by Mandy, back in 6th form, so when I saw it and Atlas Shrugged in the library sale, I had to get them. The last 2 weeks have been spent almost exclusively reading Atlas Shrugged. It has some interesting ideas, but I think that The Fountainhead covers a lot of similar ideas in a nicer way. There are parts of Atlas Shrugged where she plays on a theme too long: I was expecting to finish the last few hundred pages pretty quickly, but I got to a certain point, and then noticed that there was a 50-page monologue in front of me, so I just went to sleep instead and skipped the monologue entirely. I have since half-listened to a recording of the monologue, and it doesn’t seem to say much that wasn’t said elsewhere in the book.

One thing that it does do quite well is theorise how “from him according to his ability, to him according to his need” will fail (turning into “to each according to his want”, which could be worse than the capitalist ideal of linking ability and reward).

I am also quite interested in Rand’s concept of love. I won’t try to outline it here, for fear of being corrected, but essentially greed for the {recognition | respect | enjoyment} of another.

In other news, http://news.google.co.uk/news?q=iso+ooxml. While I think that it could have been done less forcefully, I believe that MS office having an ISO branded document format as its default is a step forward compared to .doc. The next step from here is to encourage governments to support at least one (or both) ISO document formats.

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